Curse

Jaigoda · May 07, 2009, 04:10 PM // 16:10

If things are dying before you get to your elite, why are you bringing it? And when the hell did things die in <2 seconds in any kind of higher-end PvE? And yeah, Prot Spirit and Aegis are nice, but you don't even need those if no one's taking damage. Plus, PS and Aegis is used pretty badly by heroes, and microing sucks.

Look, we've gotten hella off-topic. Honestly, I think we can come to a conclusion: In areas without block stances, there is no need for lead-offhand to start MS>DB spam, which frees up a slot for extra defense (with little or no effect to DPS). In areas with block stances, then lead-offhand becomes more appealing and CD will be harder to fit in.

Can we please get back on the subject before this thread gets closed?

Shadow Slave · May 07, 2009, 04:19 PM // 16:19

/Sigh ~

Anyway, I thought we were talking about Obscure Elites....[Moebius Strike] Isn't one of them!

I'd like [Assault Enchantments] to be acting as an elite [Impale] personally.

Mainly because I hate [Impale], and Sins need moar Deep Wound in their lives!

(Though I do have a soft spot for [Golden Fang Strike]...especially before it was fixed :3)

[Twisting Fangs] sees too much use. EDIT: Too much ninja'ing going on in this thread lol....and no, I don't agree with that 'Conclusion'.

Jaigoda · May 07, 2009, 04:56 PM // 16:56

Well, you can't please everybody, can you...

I've always wanted to work with [Siphon Strength], but it'd be pretty hard to find a good use for it considering it only hexes one foe.

Also, could we possibly expand this out to non-elites? Most 'Sin elites are either well-used or just shouldn't be used at all (poor SoS...).

[Vampiric Assault] looks like hella fun to play around with on MS>DB or something. And has anyone ever found a good use for [Mirrored Stance]?

zelgadissan · May 07, 2009, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaigoda

And has anyone ever found a good use for [Mirrored Stance]?

It's not a good use, but I've used it before in RA as anti-ranger. It's hilarious when they activate Lightning Reflexes to try to get me with a Melandru's Shot and then I block it because of Lightning Reflexes.

One time in RA I ran [Disrupting Stab][Exhausting Assault][Assault Enchantments] and managed to get 3 TA wins before losing. I don't know who that says more about, my teammates or my opponents

Since we're asking questions of each other, anybody ever found a legitimate build revolving around [[Shadow Meld]?

Bill Clinton · May 08, 2009, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaigoda

And has anyone ever found a good use for [Mirrored Stance]?

Mirrored stance I play around with in PVE, if you know what you're going up against it can be a hell-a fun. Try, for instance on Shiro.

By far my favorite experience with it was on a Charr prison guard. Catch them using [Infernal Rage] and you'll see what I mean. I always wanted to make some kind of a farming build with it... but found it too difficult to work out a way.

EDIT: Looks like the site doesnt support monster skills. Infernal rage gives you +33% Increased attack speed, Makes all of your attacks massivley AoE and grants you +1000 health to boot. Best of all, it lasts for 45 seconds.

_Nihilist_ · May 08, 2009, 11:46 AM // 11:46

Normally, Players cannot copy or use Monster-Only Skills. This is why you take Inspired Hex into Frostmaw's Burrows, it removes Wurm Bile, but since the Monster Skill can't be copied/used, it instantly recharges Inspired for spammable Bile removal.

Now, since it doesn't actually COPY the skill, like Inspired Hex would, so you as the Player cannot control/use the skill, it might just work. That would be one hell of an exploit/bug.

Still, Screen Shot for Proof, Please.

zelgadissan · May 08, 2009, 01:29 PM // 13:29

Just went and tested Mirrored Stance against Shiro, it doesn't work. I took my mesmer with a skill bar of [Echo][Mirrored Stance] and just kept alternating between the two. Neither Battle Scars nor Riposting Shadows was used. It's a good idea though, I wish it had worked.

In fact, if I had just looked at wiki first I would have known:
This hex does not work on Monster Skills (such as Turtle Shell or Battle Scars).

Buns United · May 08, 2009, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

Since we're asking questions of each other, anybody ever found a legitimate build revolving around [[Shadow Meld]?

Yeah I did, I also posted it before in the "Post your original AB build" thread.

[build prof=A/D deadly=12+1+1 critical=8 dagger=10+1][Pious Fury][Scorpion Wire][Iron Palm][Falling Spider][Vampiric Assault][Impale][Signet of Toxic Shock][Shadow Meld][/build]

It's a hell of a load of fun to play.
Basically you use [[Shadow Meld] on a teammate before engaging in battle, cast [[Scorpion [email protected]] on your target, and start your chain with [[Pious [email protected]] -> [[Falling [email protected]].
Incase for some reason, you aren't in a position to use [[Shadow Meld], use [[Iron [email protected]] to get your knockdown instead.

Using [[Shadow Meld] both offencively and defensively is fun! Not that it's thát very effective though.

zelgadissan · May 08, 2009, 05:49 PM // 17:49

I'm not gonna lie, that does look ridiculously fun, but [Shadow Meld][Pious Fury][Scorpion Wire] could be replaced by a well-timed [Wastrel's Collapse][IAS of choice]. That build was probably made before the buff of Wastrel's, but you get my point. Of course that would remove the cool double-shadowstep which is probably the main point of the build

That said, we all know fun > viability in AB, so I'd probably run it even over what I said.

EDIT: holy crap, apparently if you type random IAS inside of [], you get about 50 gajillion skill icons. Good to know.

_Nihilist_ · May 09, 2009, 12:44 AM // 00:44

The Dual Shadow Step would make for some very epic Nightcrawler action in AB. It would make my Warrior's head hurt...

Testing the random IAS thing, zelgadissan...

[random IAS]

w00t! not quite 50 gajillion, but damn...

faraaz · May 09, 2009, 06:46 AM // 06:46

At the guy with the narutard avatar...golden phoenix strike does jack shit against blockers, which is pretty much the reason most people use golden fox strike + wild strike. Secondly, if using daggers, there is no excuse not to bring SY! on your bar. Crit defenses is overrated and is a crutch for bad players who dont have a fking clue what they are doing.

Super Igor · May 10, 2009, 08:47 AM // 08:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killuminati21

[golden fox [email protected]][wild [email protected]][death [email protected]][moebius [email protected]][critical agility][critical [email protected]][save yourselves][asuran scan]

That much lower dps to be a game changer? Probably not, but I guess to each his own.

[critical defenses] sucks so bad why do you break yor ms/db with it? Any pure self-defense skill sucks really.

Shadow Slave · May 10, 2009, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Sigh..............................

Two skills I have a problem with ~ [Deadly Haste] and [Desperate Strike]

DH in particular, it looks like it could be so nice in the right build...but what's the right build?

Super Igor · May 10, 2009, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Slave

Sigh..............................

Two skills I have a problem with ~ [Deadly Haste] and [Desperate Strike]

DH in particular, it looks like it could be so nice in the right build...but what's the right build?

there isnt one, unless you want to spam [healing whisper] or [dancing daggers] or something. xD

zelgadissan · May 10, 2009, 05:41 PM // 17:41

If I had to make a build with Deadly Haste in it, it would be something like:

[build prof=A crit=10+1 dagg=12+1+1 dead=8+1][Black Mantis Thrust][Jungle Strike][Trampling Ox][Disrupting Dagger][Augury of Death][Siphon Speed][Deadly Haste][Resurrection Signet][/build]

I know it's eliteless, sue me. I don't know if DH is worth a slot with any less than three half-range spells. If only two, I'd pitch Augury for an elite of some sort, maybe something simple like AoD, hell maybe MoI.

The biggest problem Deadly Haste has is that it's a Critical Strikes skill. It can't be abused by secondaries, and no straight assacaster would use Critical Strikes, so it's a really, really niche skill that doesn't really have a niche :/

RadaArashi · May 10, 2009, 06:07 PM // 18:07

I thought I could abuse [Deadly Haste] in RA by using it with [Resurrection Chant] but it really wasn't worth it or any better than [Death Pact Signet]

Balky · May 10, 2009, 10:29 PM // 22:29

Been playing with [Siphon Strength] as it happens

A/Ra build

CS 13, DM 14, DA 8 SA2 WS3

Full Nightstalkers with radiants and 20 ench zelous daggs or whatever you want really, energy is not a problem to be honest

[Serpents Quickness] [Critical Eye] [Critical Agility] [Critical Defenses][Siphon Strength] [Asuran Scan][Dwarven Stability][Shadow Refuge] or[Deaths Charge]

occasionally i drop in [Pain Inverter] for DS

Fun build , reasonable damage for an auto attack setup ,SS reduces incoming attack damage by 29 with DA at 8 with a 59% chance of a crit on any strike

Bill Clinton · May 11, 2009, 04:50 PM // 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrael_Eveningsong

Normally, Players cannot copy or use Monster-Only Skills. This is why you take Inspired Hex into Frostmaw's Burrows, it removes Wurm Bile, but since the Monster Skill can't be copied/used, it instantly recharges Inspired for spammable Bile removal.

Now, since it doesn't actually COPY the skill, like Inspired Hex would, so you as the Player cannot control/use the skill, it might just work. That would be one hell of an exploit/bug.

Still, Screen Shot for Proof, Please.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

Just went and tested Mirrored Stance against Shiro, it doesn't work. I took my mesmer with a skill bar of [Echo][Mirrored Stance] and just kept alternating between the two. Neither Battle Scars nor Riposting Shadows was used. It's a good idea though, I wish it had worked.

In fact, if I had just looked at wiki first I would have known:
This hex does not work on Monster Skills (such as Turtle Shell or Battle Scars).

After reading both your replies just now I was kinda shocked... since just two or three months ago I had been using this skill, so I went out to check if it was nerfed or something. Turns out it hasnt... or it has, but unintentionally. I grabed a random build and added miroed stance, went to shiro - and caught him using meditation of the reaper.
Pruf:

EDIT: Looking back, this could just be me being retarded. Meditation is a skill, not a stance. But is it possible that the game mechanics treat it as a stance, not a skill?

zelgadissan · May 11, 2009, 05:01 PM // 17:01

The Meditation of the Reaper icon shows up whether you have Mirrored Stance or not. Mirrored Stance does not copy monster skills.

Added screenshot for proof. EDIT: with Patient Spirit's icon being enlarged since apparently I took the shot when it was being cast on me, you can see that is one scary face. It also partially covers the Meditation, but the point gets across.

Bill Clinton · May 11, 2009, 05:10 PM // 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelgadissan

The Meditation of the Reaper icon shows up whether you have Mirrored Stance or not. Mirrored Stance does not copy monster skills.

Added screenshot for proof. EDIT: with Patient Spirit's icon being enlarged since apparently I took the shot when it was being cast on me, you can see that is one scary face. It also partially covers the Meditation, but the point gets across.

Okay, this seems more likely. It is strange that they would nerf mirroed stance like that... I really cant see it getting any use elsewhere.
Even if you were to try and use it to exploit using a primary atribute of another profession such as with [burst of aggression] why would you ever try it over [critical agility] ?
I'm up for variations on typical, overused skills - but thats just a little too conditional for me.

As for in PVP, thats beyond me.